I appreciate that a lot of liberals are implicitly conceding now that they did a smear campaign against George W. Bush that was mostly untrue to try to win the 2004 and 2008 elections. But, ya know, it doesn’t change the fact that you did that and our politics are worse for it.
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I think some of the Bush hate was unhinged but no more so than the Clinton hate from the GOP in 1990s. (Hillary is a lesbian who murdered her lover Vince Foster? 🤣) What smears do you mean in particular?
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Replying to @CathyYoung63
Oh yeah 100% I think Republican smear campaigns are worse in general but I have more lib followers so I like to needle them. I think they tried to make it seem like Iraq was an unwinnable disaster in the mid to late 2000s when that wasn’t what any balanced analysis of the situation showed at that time. And they didn’t say this about Afghanistan where it would have been way more defensible which makes it seem like a weaponized partisan narrative to me. To their credit, Hillary and Obama both acknowledged they got it wrong on the troop surge but I’ve heard very few liberals admit that the far more catastrophic fallout from the Arab Spring kind of calls the entire narrative into question—how much can you even really blame Bush for the violence at all? That’s what I have expertise on anyways. I also this his proposed social security reforms that get demonized so much were quite sensible. It makes me skeptical of things I know much less about, like Katrina for example, because I feel like Bush got railroaded by negative media coverage in a similar way to how Biden later was to be honest with you.

Sep 12, 2026 · 5:08 PM UTC

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The thing is, though, you're never going to have it only go one way. Especially after Lee Atwater and company torched Mike Dukakis in the ugliest campaign possible, there was 0 way Democrats wouldn't also start playing hardball. Unfortunately, it works well.
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You don't need an excuse. Liberals should be needled for the transgressions they support, and conservatives should be needled for theirs. One doesn't justify or invalidate the other. People need to start taking f***ing responsibility for their own parties.
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Yes, but unfortunately 99% of the time people only talk about the other party's sins
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The White House told us the war would last a month
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Ok, as long as you admit you're trolling. Bush sucked. The lies, the impunity, the belligerent jingoism, and the Karl Rovian ratfucking from his administration turned Republicans into a party that was ripe for Trump's takeover. Have a nice day 😊
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I'm not going to say nobody portrayed Iraq as unwinnable - my memory of that word from that time blurs Iraq and Afghanistan - but I remember the framing as "Afghanistan was justified and Iraq was not." Ironic that we ultimately succeeded in the latter but not the former.
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Sorry, but to this Independent your post reads like making excuses because you like GW. There's a really obvious reason that Iraq was criticized much more than Afghanistan.
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You jumped ahead to the debate on whether it was winnable in the later years of the war, but it was an optional elective war that Bush Admin marketed us to get to do, not because they had to.
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Iraq was an unwinnable disaster. We were promised a beacon of liberal democracy that shifted the whole region away from Islamist tendencies not a sectarian illiberal democracy that is stable but not successful.
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"...what any balanced analysis ... showed..." “Argument by Assertion is the logical fallacy where someone tries to argue a point by merely asserting that it is true, regardless of contradiction. “While this may seem stupid it's…quite common.” [ Rational Wiki DotOrg ]
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Wait, so if Iraq was so winnable, then why didn't we win it? Certainly not because Democrats were mean to him. And his SS privatization push was very bad. Democrats simply did politics. Bush was delusional, thinking he had a mandate to "spend his political capital" after 2004.
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The US did win the Iraq War. Pretty good evidence that Americans would be better off today if that bill passed.
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Afghanistan we were 100% justified going in, Iraq we were not because we were lied to about the reasons. The hindsight of how they turned out 20 years later doesn't change that and the difficulty in Iraq and eventual failure in afghanistan is largely due Bush's bungling.
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I think you are forgetting what the wars were like in the 2000s. The Afghani Taliban was still regrouping, meanwhile Iraq was spiraling into sectarian warfare.
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Having lived through those things, I find this odd We broke norms and our own standards by starting a preemptive war in Iraq. It was very controversial at the time. Turned out bad And to suggest that W was somehow railroaded regarding the disaster in NO is an amazing revision.
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It WAS a completely unwinnable disaster. And it was illegal. And there was no reason or justification for it. And it accomplished nothing and cost us dearly.
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“I believe this one thing whole heartedly but I like to be a troll.” The blight of the age. 🙄
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He had good ideas on edu. The left’s reaction to it & Obama’s failed attempt to rein them in has been a disaster And it would’ve been much better for us if he’d fixed entitlements But he also got us into a strategically catastrophic war of choice that changed everything forever
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There will be no tears for Bush. He absolutely deserved it for his appointment of an incompetent FEMA Director and letting President Chaney run the wars.
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The problem with the Iraq war wasn’t so much that it might result in country building. It was that it went after the wrong people. In most ways, 20 years later, Iraq is moderately successful. But the Iraq war was sold on the fact that we were going after terrorists Not true
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This reads like the manifesto of an asshole who’s always confidently wrong. Just contrarian nonsense masquerading as insight.
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